Advancing and retarding

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Doug G
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Advancing and retarding

Post by Doug G » Thu Feb 17, 2011 21:17

Given that I am virtually surrounded by a total bunch of idiots and that I shall have to do it myself.

Now what is the best way to set the timing.

I do not have a strobelight.

The fuel mixture is just about perfect, according to the Gunson Colourtune.

The engine is hard to start from cold (Yes it is a relative term as it is 84ºF here).

So how do I proceed? :shock:
Having a moking good time!

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Doug G
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Re: Advancing and retarding

Post by Doug G » Thu Feb 17, 2011 21:23

The reason for trying to get this correct is to see what effect it will have (if any) on the overheating of the engine. :)
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Doug G
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Re: Advancing and retarding

Post by Doug G » Thu Feb 17, 2011 21:26

Does bad or out of whack timing cause or contribute to overheating?
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Tim
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Re: Advancing and retarding

Post by Tim » Fri Feb 18, 2011 1:55

Yes, it can cause overheating, retarded timing is worse than advanced. Its pretty difficult to do properly without a timing light. You can do static timing to get it roughly right, but to be honest its years since I did it and would have to look it up. Something to do with feeler gauges in the points and top dead centre, you'd need to look it up. You might need to invest in a timing light and a small mirror.

Your total bunch of idiots should be able to set the timing, its pretty easy.

Tim

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Robin Jones
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Re: Advancing and retarding

Post by Robin Jones » Fri Feb 18, 2011 11:39

My standing offer for thing's mechanical on Doug's Moke:
Just pick up my airfare and beer tab and I'll sort it out for you. :)
Mind you, it might take a week or three...

For viewing the timing marks, I made up a little tool. Take a small mirror (I used one from a make up kit. I'm pretty sure it was Nigel no top's) and velcro it to a small scrap of aluminum sheet. Drill a 5/16" hole in the aluminum & bend the whole mess up so you can see the timing marks from in front of the engine. It frees up a hand and makes timing a one-man job.
This is Matt Jones Son of Robin.

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Doug G
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Re: Advancing and retarding

Post by Doug G » Fri Feb 18, 2011 17:40

Robin Jones wrote:Just pick up my airfare and beer tab and I'll sort it out for you. :)
I did not realize that you have dropped your air fare on the ground, along with the beer tab from your last can of Bud?
I realize that you probably have difficulty bending over and touching the griund after rebuilding a Mini Moke. Can you not get somebody ele to bend over and pick them up for you. :roll:
That way you can get here quicker. :D

Thanks for the tip with the viewing mirror.
Having a moking good time!

Nigel(no top)Sykes
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Re: Advancing and retarding

Post by Nigel(no top)Sykes » Fri Feb 18, 2011 20:11

With the engine running twist the dizzy 'til it sounds right :D And that's without the airfare :D
Chasing gt3's

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Doug G
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Re: Advancing and retarding

Post by Doug G » Fri Feb 18, 2011 20:36

Which way advances and which way retards?
Clockwise /anticlockwise?
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Robin Jones
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Re: Advancing and retarding

Post by Robin Jones » Fri Feb 18, 2011 23:10

If you're going to do the mirror trick, find a flashlight (torch) that has an adjustable magnetic base. You can shine it on the mirror, illuminating the timing marks.
I think rotating the dizzy clockwise advances.... but, I've never really paid attention. Always done it with a timing light.
If you're going to invest in one, get it with the dial back feature. Makes setting max advance a doodle. And, as long as it idles/runs okay that's the important figure.

Now, just for fun, try and describe a rotation without referring to a clock.
Ain't so easy is it?
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Doug G
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Re: Advancing and retarding

Post by Doug G » Sat Feb 19, 2011 2:07

Robin Jones wrote:Now, just for fun, try and describe a rotation without referring to a clock.
Ain't so easy is it?

''CLOCKWISE' EQUIVALENT discription: Turn the distributor as if tightening a right hand threaded screw.
Easy way to say it "Turn it like you are tightening a screw"


'ANTI-CLOCKWISE' EQUIVALENT discription: Turn the distributor as if loosening a right hand threaded screw.
Easy way to say it "Turn it like you are loosening a screw"

Explanation:
Using the right hand screw thread method you will undo a screw by turning the screw in the direction of your right hand fingertips if they are gripping the screw driver in a fist with your thumb pointing upwards.

That OK for you? :wink:





PS This works unless you are taking to somebody that works with gas. Gas industry uses left hand threads :)
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Robin Jones
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Re: Advancing and retarding

Post by Robin Jones » Sat Feb 19, 2011 3:41

Ah, but what about my boss that has absolutely no idea which way to turn a screw. He just doesn't get the whole "Lefty loosey, righty tighty" thing.
As he said, "They invented flip top toothpaste tubes just for guys like me." :roll:
Just try and explain anything mechanical to this boob. :roll:
But, he signs the checks so I just work around him....
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Tim
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Re: Advancing and retarding

Post by Tim » Sat Feb 19, 2011 4:07

I often use the right hand rule, especially when I'm doing up a nut with a weird orientation (like when I'm on my back and working by touch). Hold your right hand up with your thumb pointing in the direction the nut or bolt needs to move and your fingers point the direction to turn it.

If you are doing gas fittings or the nut on the right hand rear hub, hold up your left hand.

Another useful tip. Watch out for markings on nuts to indicate that they are left handed. Its not always done, but worth remembering.
Image

Now did that help get your timing sorted?

Tim

Nigel(no top)Sykes
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Re: Advancing and retarding

Post by Nigel(no top)Sykes » Sat Feb 19, 2011 10:34

Also, on the dizzy there is a little arrow showing the direction of rotation !
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Doug G
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Re: Advancing and retarding

Post by Doug G » Sat Feb 19, 2011 13:42

Robin Jones wrote:Ah, but what about my boss that has absolutely no idea which way to turn a screw. He just doesn't get the whole "Lefty loosey, righty tighty" thing.
As he said, "They invented flip top toothpaste tubes just for guys like me." :roll:
Print and give this to your boss.

Image
Having a moking good time!

greyhead
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Re: Advancing and retarding

Post by greyhead » Sun May 15, 2011 16:05

Hi , I had this problem too but not quite in the same way, when my moke arrived it would start but only just, the choke had to be fully out and the engine spat back alarmingly until it warmed up which took absolutely ages with lots of smoke etc, any reduction in choke caused stalling when throttle opened.
After sitting and thinking a while-i thought no thermostat, so I checked and there wasn't one , fitted new one. Better but still the same problem (plugs were always sooty too). Hmm checked timing with simple 12V bulb clipped to coil then earth, light comes on this when points open, took plugs out and put car in gear pushed/pulled car until 1/4 5 10 15 marks in the timing viewing hole on the bell housing came up, loosend distributor clamp bolt, moved car forward until tdc came up (1/4 mark), correct setting for my moke 850cc H number, then turned distributor until bulb just lit up, tightened bolt all done. Didn't use micro click knob as it did not seem to work. Tried to use strobe to do running test but could not see timing marks in mirror-but my sight isn't great. Tried engine again- no better. Could it be carburetor-no, lifting needle when running showed carb spot on (no increase or decrease in revs) So checked distributor gap- way too tight, set to correct gap-------amazing no problems at all engine ran fine even when cold , plugs showed clean, warm up was very quick was I glad !! Hope this helps you

Phil Heybridge Essex

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